Wikipedia:Main Page/Errors

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Today's FA[edit]

Tomorrow's FA[edit]

Day-after-tomorrow's FA[edit]

Please insert the following small styling and grammtical changes: * In the the Rwandan general election, Paul Kagame (pictured) is re-elected president, and the Rwandan Patriotic Front coalition wins a majority in the lower house. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MeAmME (talk • contribs) 07:48, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

• @MeAmME: Thanks for the report. Your suggested change would be correct in American English. However, this article is written in British/Commonwealth English, and in that variant, the plural form is used. For more information, please see Wikipedia:Manual of Style#Plurals. Regards, Newyorkbrad (talk) 11:51, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  Understand. But it still has to be styled: "Paul Kagame (pictured) is re-elected as president", not "as the president". Regards, MeAmME (talk) 11:58, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  I am good with that change. Does anyone disagree? Newyorkbrad (talk) 12:12, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  This sort of change was recently declined by Stephen due to the capitalization complications. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 12:39, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Current DYK[edit]

'President Obama' -> 'Barack Obama' please. His first name isn't President. Modest Genius ^talk 10:39, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

'President Obama' means that he was president at the time of the event, which seems fine. TSventon (talk) 10:53, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think anybody is disputing the fact that Obama was the US president in 2016. However, using the title in running text does appear contrary to MOS:HONORIFIC. If it's necessary to clarify that he was the president (I don't see why), then it should be something like led by the then president of the United States, Barack Obama. – Joe (talk) 12:07, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That would certainly be better in an article, but perhaps not in a DYK blurb, where concise wording is the norm. Newyorkbrad (talk) 12:11, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As far as I know the MOS applies to DYK the same as anywhere else. The concise, MOS-compliant option would be led by Barack Obama, as Modest Genius suggests. That's also my preference. – Joe (talk) 12:21, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"President" is not an honorific, just a job title. This sort of formulation is used as a good example at MOS:JOBTITLE, which approves of "President Nixon". Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 12:38, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What I suggested above (lowercase president) would be an example of using as a job title; capitalising it and joining it to a name is using it as an honorific. MOS:JOBTITLE merely uses President Nixon as an example of proper capitalisation, it doesn't say anything about where to use it. – Joe (talk) 12:57, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I don't understand. Where could "President Nixon" be used so that you would consider it to be a job title and not an honorific? Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 13:01, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nowhere. If used like that, it's a job title formed into an honorific (title). You'll note that the part of WP:JOBTITLE you're citing also says this: When followed by a person's name to form a title [...]. – Joe (talk) 13:07, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

When you said "(lowercase president) would be an example of using as a job title; capitalising it and joining it to a name is using it as an honorific", I guess I thought you were denying that it was a title. Since its a title, capitalized in accordance with JOBTITLE, I think we're good. I think maybe you're opposed to such uses, considering them also to be honorifics, but I wouldn't interpret the different parts of the guideline to clash like that. In any case, this usage is so commonplace that a change would need to be a wider discussion. For example, every result on the first page of an "in source" caps-insensitive search for "President Obama"] capitalizes the P. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 13:17, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Technically the Main Page is not an article, so MOS doesn't apply e.g. we don't enforce MOS:LAYOUT. Regardless, MOS:JOBTITLES is an incoherent and self-contradictory mess which causes no end of problems on WP:ERRORS. We should ignore it (and preferably replace it with a more sensible guideline). Regardless, MOS:JOBTITLES says nothing about when to use this construction, only how to capitalise it. Modest Genius ^talk 13:37, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

In U.S. English, OK only on 2nd mention and subsequently. -- Sca (talk) 13:26, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I concur with this change, I definitely think it should say Barack Obama per MOS:HONORIFIC and usual conventions. This applies to DYK as much as anywhere else.  — Amakuru (talk) 13:16, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with Modest, Amakuru. In U.S. English, on first mention, President followed by the name without intervening punct. requires the last name to be preceded by the first: President Barack Obama. – Sca (talk) 13:23, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I wouldn't object to "President Barack Obama". I object to "Barack Obama", without the title, since it loses hookiness. I object to "president Obama" or "president Barack Obama", per the above. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 13:30, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

If his position at the time is somehow relevant to the blurb (I'm not convinced it is), the blurb would need to specify what he was president of e.g. 'President of the United States, Barack Obama'. Modest Genius ^talk 13:34, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Next DYK[edit]

Next-but-one DYK[edit]

Today's OTD[edit]

Tomorrow's OTD[edit]

Day-after-tomorrow's OTD[edit]

Friday's FL[edit]

Monday's FL[edit]

Today's POTD[edit]

Tomorrow's POTD[edit]

Please report any such problems or suggestions for improvement at the General discussion section of Talk:Main Page.